• basmati@lemmus.org
    link
    fedilink
    English
    arrow-up
    14
    arrow-down
    3
    ·
    2 months ago

    Democrats have no interest in democracy or anything that weakens their corporate power, like rcv/star/democratic voting methods.

    • rigatti@lemmy.world
      link
      fedilink
      English
      arrow-up
      6
      arrow-down
      2
      ·
      2 months ago

      I don’t think that’s true of all Democrats. Have there not been progressives pushing for alternative voting methods?

      • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
        link
        fedilink
        arrow-up
        9
        arrow-down
        1
        ·
        2 months ago

        Almost entirely signal boosted as proof of a carrot that both will most likely never arrive, and most likely won’t change anything even if it did arrive. There’s a large difference between individuals pushing for something and them actually managing to get them passed at a scale that matters.

        • Pup Biru@aussie.zone
          link
          fedilink
          English
          arrow-up
          3
          arrow-down
          2
          ·
          2 months ago

          okay but it’s been passed in plenty of your states and that hasn’t been without democrat party support

          you don’t just change the system overnight - change like that can take a lifetime, and it starts with signalling to move the overton window

          • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
            link
            fedilink
            arrow-up
            4
            arrow-down
            2
            ·
            2 months ago

            okay but it’s been passed in plenty of your states and that hasn’t been without democrat party support

            Very few states, actually, and it passed in Alaska in a Republican state. Overall, it has weak momentum.

            you don’t just change the system overnight - change like that can take a lifetime, and it starts with signalling to move the overton window

            How do you signal to “move the overton window?” Prayer?

            • MegaUltraChicken@lemmy.world
              link
              fedilink
              arrow-up
              3
              arrow-down
              3
              ·
              2 months ago

              How do you signal to “move the overton window?” Prayer?

              If only there was some kind of smaller election before the general election where we get to vote on who represents the Democratic party…

              • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                4
                ·
                2 months ago

                If only we could vote on leftist candidates in the primary for the DNC, as though it isn’t a grand filter before anyone even gets to run…

                • MegaUltraChicken@lemmy.world
                  link
                  fedilink
                  arrow-up
                  1
                  arrow-down
                  2
                  ·
                  2 months ago

                  Is there a sitting member of the Democratic party that you would consider a “leftist” or one that holds leftist values?

                  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    5
                    ·
                    2 months ago

                    Depends on what you mean by “leftist values.” The closest is probably Rashida Tlaib, but in general “The Squad” consists of Social Democrats, which I would consider Center-Right.

            • Pup Biru@aussie.zone
              link
              fedilink
              English
              arrow-up
              2
              arrow-down
              2
              ·
              edit-2
              2 months ago

              the overton window aka “the window of discourse” is literally about talking, and making things more acceptable by their existence in the public consciousness

              the more people TALK about alternative voting mechanisms, the more likely it is for some change to occur… 1 person can’t just up and change the system overnight, but by “signalling” as you’ve dismissively called it, it makes it more likely that other people talk about it and that makes it more likely that it becomes policy

              • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
                link
                fedilink
                arrow-up
                5
                arrow-down
                1
                ·
                2 months ago

                How does “signaling” translate to policy? The majority of Americans want abortion codified, legal weed, single payer healthcare, increased gun protection, and more. Why do you think these haven’t passed?

                • Pup Biru@aussie.zone
                  link
                  fedilink
                  English
                  arrow-up
                  2
                  arrow-down
                  3
                  ·
                  edit-2
                  2 months ago

                  these are separate issues; i never said signalling is the end game, but it has to start there and build

                  if you want IRV etc to be in the same category as abortion rights and cannabis (as in majority of people think “why the fuck isn’t this done yet?” rather than “huh? what?”) then it starts with simply convincing politicians to acknowledge their support for it - heck even acknowledging it as an issue

                  there is literally no way to get to policy through a grassroots without it first having a few people “signalling”

                  • Cowbee [he/they]@lemmy.ml
                    link
                    fedilink
                    arrow-up
                    4
                    arrow-down
                    1
                    ·
                    2 months ago

                    How do you start? How does it “build?” How does this translate into reality?

                    Reality doesn’t run on 40k Ork magic logic, ideas don’t become material reality if you believe hard enough.