That’s a good metaphor! I’m not sure about the rock though, throwing a rock into a complicated machine doesn’t seem like the best idea. I’d consider replacing it with oil, where it needs to cover the gears at the top first before it can drip down.
Yes! That’s the point of the metaphor! The SSRI is the rock. We’re not exactly sure how it’s gonna land, or what it’s total effects are on the machine, but it’s the tool we have and it’s the one we’re using. I don’t remember where I heard it, but I instantly understood why I became so paranoid all those years ago when I tried antidepressants.
edit: and that doesn’t mean that a person shouldn’t try using them. They can be incredibly effective. But they are what they are. Not a quick fix, and (to most people) not a long term solution.
SSRIs are the most effective means we have in terms of medication. That doesn’t mean that they’re the solution. They’re a short term stop gap. The changing of routines and everything that goes on in appointments with psychologists is supposed to be the oil. Many times however that oil isn’t used.
Other than that we can only hope that we figure out some better tool for the job.
Some doctor told my dad a while ago that he felt like we weren’t that far off from physically poking around in a mind and hoping that we fixed it- or that we’re closer to that than understanding it.
It’s an old and second hand story. I do appreciate the idea though that we’ve found ways to disrupt the mind that can be beneficial, but that we’re not at the level of being able to do more than throw a cog in the works in a general direction.
For me it makes it easier to accept when the first - or second thing does work. We’re just trying things. It’s not like we know what is gonna unclog the works.
This is getting pretty deep into a metaphor. Sorry
but having a proper solution would make selling meds for a long time harder!
weed has many medicinal effects, and yet it’s illegal in most places
LSD has many medicinal effects, and yet it’s not even allowed to be studied in most places! There’s so many stories out there saying how psychedelics outright cured someone’s depression or anxiety, but no proper in depth studies on them.
I think it’s because nobody is really looking for a cure, well, I bet a lot of doctors want to but sadly they depend on funding & legality of their research. The only way for them to do any studies is to get money from the money men & a permission from the goverment (also ruled by the money men), and since they’re trying to look into claims like “one dose of this cheap to make drug cured me of depression!” then the best business decision is to say “fuck off”
I enjoy exploring altered states of being and the first time I tried LSD, after maybe a week or so, I discovered I was suddenly capable of saying no to people. Before that I’d sacrifice my own wellbeing just so I could help another person with something minor. During the LSD trip I remember seeing myself in my mind and the other me told me “love yourself more”.
This is one account of hundrets, if not thousands, of ones similar to mine. LSD (and psychedelics in general) most certainly has properties that can be incredibly beneficial for mental health.
Per weed it helps you chill out lol, not much to say here, it’s alcohol lite but without being physically addictive. Wonderful for anxiety, just not long term most likely.
This is all awesome but any mind altering substance really needs to be used with a therapist when we are talking about average people in a large population. I’d also argue they both have benefits but their drawbacks are just too strong.
Weed is mostly non addictive but comes with other issues and isn’t perfect. Heart issues? Family history of schizophrenia? Either of those could be really bad. Is this a good argument for legalization and harm reduction? Yes. I’m not sure about widespread psychiatric use though. Perhaps more with a therapist but that therapist would be key - similar to the shamans of indigenous cultures.
I also totally agree with these not being long term. I love weed but the “420 smoke every dayyyyyyy” culture also ignores the need to work on yourself and do the work with a clear head. I think that internal (ideally drug free and sober) work gets you to the point of not only benefitting from these drugs but avoiding their abuse.
LSD is a double edged sword and I ackowledge that. Good trips can fix you, bad trips can break you. The thing I’m getting at is that there’s been little to no progress made in trying to understand that substance and its properties since it became illegal.
I’m not advocating for replacing therapy with LSD of course, just saying that there’s incredible potential in that substance that the world of science is being forced to ignore. And just as you mentioned - controlled use of psychedelics for the purpose of self growth has been a thing in many human cultures, the fact it’s being stigmatised so hard right now is just odd tbf
And yeah absolutely, I wholeheartedly subscribe to Watt’s quote “Once you get the message, hang up the phone”, there’s only so much your drugged mind can come up with, it can give you good starting off points but that’s only the beginning.
Oil doesn’t fix alignment of gears. Ideally, you need to precisely go in and realign the exact gear. But we don’t have that power. So we’re throwing rocks.
That’s a good metaphor! I’m not sure about the rock though, throwing a rock into a complicated machine doesn’t seem like the best idea. I’d consider replacing it with oil, where it needs to cover the gears at the top first before it can drip down.
Yes! That’s the point of the metaphor! The SSRI is the rock. We’re not exactly sure how it’s gonna land, or what it’s total effects are on the machine, but it’s the tool we have and it’s the one we’re using. I don’t remember where I heard it, but I instantly understood why I became so paranoid all those years ago when I tried antidepressants.
edit: and that doesn’t mean that a person shouldn’t try using them. They can be incredibly effective. But they are what they are. Not a quick fix, and (to most people) not a long term solution.
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SSRIs are the most effective means we have in terms of medication. That doesn’t mean that they’re the solution. They’re a short term stop gap. The changing of routines and everything that goes on in appointments with psychologists is supposed to be the oil. Many times however that oil isn’t used.
Other than that we can only hope that we figure out some better tool for the job.
it’s the best thing we’ve got. and honestly, it ain’t that bad
personally the first week it fucked me up but after that, life changing effects. truly life changing.
Some doctor told my dad a while ago that he felt like we weren’t that far off from physically poking around in a mind and hoping that we fixed it- or that we’re closer to that than understanding it.
It’s an old and second hand story. I do appreciate the idea though that we’ve found ways to disrupt the mind that can be beneficial, but that we’re not at the level of being able to do more than throw a cog in the works in a general direction.
For me it makes it easier to accept when the first - or second thing does work. We’re just trying things. It’s not like we know what is gonna unclog the works.
This is getting pretty deep into a metaphor. Sorry
puts conspiracy hat on
but having a proper solution would make selling meds for a long time harder!
weed has many medicinal effects, and yet it’s illegal in most places
LSD has many medicinal effects, and yet it’s not even allowed to be studied in most places! There’s so many stories out there saying how psychedelics outright cured someone’s depression or anxiety, but no proper in depth studies on them.
I think it’s because nobody is really looking for a cure, well, I bet a lot of doctors want to but sadly they depend on funding & legality of their research. The only way for them to do any studies is to get money from the money men & a permission from the goverment (also ruled by the money men), and since they’re trying to look into claims like “one dose of this cheap to make drug cured me of depression!” then the best business decision is to say “fuck off”
while what you say totally stands in capitalism, lsd and weed are probably quite bad ideas.
i think.
I enjoy exploring altered states of being and the first time I tried LSD, after maybe a week or so, I discovered I was suddenly capable of saying no to people. Before that I’d sacrifice my own wellbeing just so I could help another person with something minor. During the LSD trip I remember seeing myself in my mind and the other me told me “love yourself more”.
This is one account of hundrets, if not thousands, of ones similar to mine. LSD (and psychedelics in general) most certainly has properties that can be incredibly beneficial for mental health.
Per weed it helps you chill out lol, not much to say here, it’s alcohol lite but without being physically addictive. Wonderful for anxiety, just not long term most likely.
This is all awesome but any mind altering substance really needs to be used with a therapist when we are talking about average people in a large population. I’d also argue they both have benefits but their drawbacks are just too strong.
Weed is mostly non addictive but comes with other issues and isn’t perfect. Heart issues? Family history of schizophrenia? Either of those could be really bad. Is this a good argument for legalization and harm reduction? Yes. I’m not sure about widespread psychiatric use though. Perhaps more with a therapist but that therapist would be key - similar to the shamans of indigenous cultures.
I also totally agree with these not being long term. I love weed but the “420 smoke every dayyyyyyy” culture also ignores the need to work on yourself and do the work with a clear head. I think that internal (ideally drug free and sober) work gets you to the point of not only benefitting from these drugs but avoiding their abuse.
LSD is a double edged sword and I ackowledge that. Good trips can fix you, bad trips can break you. The thing I’m getting at is that there’s been little to no progress made in trying to understand that substance and its properties since it became illegal.
I’m not advocating for replacing therapy with LSD of course, just saying that there’s incredible potential in that substance that the world of science is being forced to ignore. And just as you mentioned - controlled use of psychedelics for the purpose of self growth has been a thing in many human cultures, the fact it’s being stigmatised so hard right now is just odd tbf
And yeah absolutely, I wholeheartedly subscribe to Watt’s quote “Once you get the message, hang up the phone”, there’s only so much your drugged mind can come up with, it can give you good starting off points but that’s only the beginning.
Oil doesn’t fix alignment of gears. Ideally, you need to precisely go in and realign the exact gear. But we don’t have that power. So we’re throwing rocks.