- cross-posted to:
- technews@radiation.party
- cross-posted to:
- technews@radiation.party
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We should not be building our cities in ways that necessitate owning a car.
That ship has sailed a long time ago
Never too late to change. Just look at Amsterdam now vs a couple decades ago
I know Jersey City has made a big push to bikify the city, and limited parking in new high-density development, with the idea being if you build it, they will come. It’s part of an overall plan that they date out to 2060. Shit takes time. Doesn’t mean you don’t try though, that’s for sure. I’m hopeful.
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I’d argue that Amsterdam isn’t a great example, as the infrastructure of that city was largely built before the advent of automobiles, then converted to support a more Americanized design that was vehicle-centric, before finally realizing, “Hey, we’re Dutch, not American, we need more space for our bicycles!”
If we’re discussing American infrastructure designed in the 20th century, it seems to be pretty difficult to convert because the physical structures of both the transportation infrastructure and the destinations people want to visit are not built densely enough to make going without a car a top tier option for most people.
I mean this broadly, not to say that there aren’t opportunities to start moving this in the other direction, but emphasizing that changing the focus to downplay the importance of vehicles will be neither quick, cheap, or easy.
It’s gonna be crashing on the shore pretty soon at this rate.
You’re right, let’s not change with the times but just lay down and die, nothing is worth the effort.
What are we gonna do, nuke all the suburbs and cram everyone into little pods?
It’s about oil and profits. They want us to need a car to go anywhere. More cars, more oil, more profits, RIGHT?
Just bought an 11 year old car for 12k. Because a new one would’ve wiped out my savings and then some after saving for 5 years to replace my 20 year old car. Nobody can afford shit.
People need to stop “pretending” they can afford all this shit, it’s not needed and noone cares, who are people showing off too?
New iphone? Don’t need it
Maybe if we stop buying shit these companies will actually try
They’ll just cut you off from your subscription if you don’t buy buy buy.
That’s all the 80 month car loans are at this point.
I bought a boat last year and now I want a bigger one. I’ve got lots of disposable income because I don’t live beyond my means. Lots of people carry credit card debt and spend stupidly. Don’t do that and you’ll likely be ahead of most people.
The boats are around 2k. Not huge rich guy money.
The cost of a boat is primarily in upkeep, not price. You’ll see.
You say primarily. Only really on the long term. It’s mid 20 foot sail boats. I can learn to do fiberglass/painting, etc myself. Paying tradesmen is where the cost is.
Fiberglass ain’t cheap either brother. You need to fix a water tank? Just looking at fiberglass makes your wallet lighter $500, and costs rise exponentially.
Problem with your inverter? Batteries? Generator? 3k a piece, and that’s if you’re shopping around.
Don’t get me wrong, I live off-grid and after doing it for a few years we decided a while back that if it’s not rated marine we just aren’t interested in it. Everything rusts. Every bullshit thing in the market is designed to fail after 200 cycles, just past the 180day warranty. But marine ratings are actually enforced. So everything we own has steadily become aluminum or stainless steel. Redoing finishes and waterproofing, oiling. Protecting shit from the weather is almost a full time job.
And then the canvas. And the rigging. And the ropes. Rope is without question my favorite tool. I know a solid 50+ knots I can do blindfolded, upside down and behind my back hanging in a tree. Bro, I love sailing, and rigging for that matter, and I won’t even do what your doing and I’m in my early 40s, childless, no debt, own two businesses, have no rent or mortgage payment - and I can’t afford a boat.
Godspeed my man.
I just love him arguing with you when you clearly were speaking from wisdom gained by experience (even if it’s experience of others, idk)
There’s a reason there is a famous joke about the happiest days of a boat owners life are the day he bought it and the day he sold it.
But if anyone knows a work around I’d say this OP is a bit down that list already lol
I’m not rebuilding a boat. I’m finding a boat in good condition with space to basically camp for a week. Inverter? Generator? Bro I’m not buying a yacht. I’m looking at 50 year old boats built like tanks with matching accomodations. Just want to get out there and have some fun. Lines can get rough and ugly but still have years in them when it’s double braid. Also it’s going to be in fresh water for most of its life. Merely interested in patching any bad looking stuff with fairing compound, hit it with some bottom paint every now and then. I already passed on a 1972(?) Pearson 26 (soft spots in the deck), now looking at an Ericson 27 instead.
Forget this guy. Just go enjoy your boat if its within your means. Not everybody wants to or is psychologically able to sit around and do nothing in the name of saving money. Maybe boats are depreciating assets, but so too are our lives.
I bought a boat last year and now I want a bigger one…I don’t live beyond my means…spend stupidly…
🤯🤯🤯
Homie. You just bought the largest money sink there is. You can drop 20k into your 2k boat and when you turn around and sell it you’ll get your 2k back, that’s it, maybe. All the amenities are nice, but no one cares if the all the outlets match the drapes - that’s why buying either is stupid, financially.
Fences are another good example. They can cost tens of thousands…EASY. In fact if I heard a neighbor fenced even one side of their yard for under 5k id be in shock. They make a place more livable, more comfortable. They increase the likelihood of a sale but they don’t increase property value so you’re never getting a return on that money.
Be it fences, boats, outlet covers or drapes, those are all emotional purchases. Their value is subjective, so most find when it’s time to move on from them theyre the only ones who see that value.
Like go spend 5k on a couch. How much you think your gonna get for that? Or your mattress?
Better live on your next boat if you like life on the water. It’s literally the only way I’ve ever seen anyone who works for a paycheck hold onto a boat. A real boat. The kind that you have to moar and drydock once every few years. Only way.
Dude not everything has to turn a profit, people are familiar with depreciating assets, they are allowed enjoy things though.
Honestly I thought fences was a euphemism because there’s no way you think people invest in fences for financial reasons. It’s for aesthetics and privacy.
It’s a hobby. I’m doing a proper checking to make sure everything is sound and not putting money in for it to look pretty, just to sail around and camp on the water on the weekend. Like I said I’m far from broke.
To be clear, you can have any hobby you want my man, that’s cool. You do you. I’m not taking umbrage due to your taste or aesthetics. The part that offends is your condescending attitude towards other peoples spending, while you do one of the most expensive “hobbies” there are. If the contrast isn’t striking to you or you think you’ve earned some next level respect, having risen above the mere mortals and all, well then you just come off quite Antoinette, and as a quick reminder, that’s not a good look either.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying that’s what this is or putting you on blast, I’m just saying it’s bringing these vibes to me and putting that on the table. You do with it what you will. If there’s something I can tell ya that’s universal across cultures, it’s lend a hand to help, bring people up with you, and attack up, not down, especially with jokes, opinions and attitudes.
Otherwise you’re just a kiss ass for people with more money/power than you. And idk man, some people are comfortable licking boots and kneeling, I don’t get it but it is what it is, it’s just not something I can quantifying into a price. The rest of us just have to cope, I guess, with owning our dignity, integrity and spines. For some people everything is for sale.
I’m curious. What car did you buy? I hate how everything is so inflated. I bought a mint civic si for 8 grand like 6 years ago. I kinda want insight/realize everything is fucked.
We picked up a 12 year old civic hatchback before Covid for 5k and it was in immaculate like-new condition, low miles. It got totaled right after our other car’s engine finally wore out. I then found a 10 year old Toyota for 16k. It was the lowest price in a 200-mile radius for cars/small trucks with under 150k miles on them that weren’t limping/totaled/savaged.
It was fucking flabbergasting.
You got yours 6 years ago. 8k was about average for a decent used car then. Now you’re paying almost full price for a 5 year old car or if you’re okay with a shit box that may or may not last then you can drop 5k. I got a 2012 GTI.
Don’t buy a new car. New cars are for rich suckers. Cars are the most common type of depreciating asset.
If you’re rich you don’t care
exactly why you should go for a second hand one if you aren’t drowning in generational wealth.
What? My point stands. If you care, you aren’t rich. You just have some cash from a few good years.
Would you care about the deprecation in value of your toothbrush?
I saw this on TikTok and it’s been burned into my brain since.
https://cdn1.frocdn.ch/vZBqPK4EuWepdGt.mp4 (link might not work with some security settings).
The amount of money seemingly regular people are dumping into car payments is unreal.
Could you link the clip somewhere else? That host is blocked in basically every layer imaginable for me - uBlock, bad SSL settings and AdGuard
If you care enough, just open it up in a private window or a new profile. Also, unless you don’t want whoever is between you and their server (if anyone is) knowing you watched a TikTok video of a woman going around asking other woman what their car payments are, bad SSL settings is whatever.
Here’s the original link: https://www.tiktok.com/@toyotacargirls/video/7202381347908832558
I just didn’t want to deal with people complaining about “A TIKTOK? ON MY LEMMIES?”
Either way, I can’t win with you people.
Trying to figure out how to flush my DNS cache on my phone was just a little bit too much, to be honest.
An alternative for next time could be to link the clip through ProxiTok, that’s unlikely to offend anyone.
On the topic of the clip, hot damn. I’ve seen similar videos from other car dealerships before, and it’s always so damn depressing to see.
I’ve had 3 cars the first was 10yo when i bought it, the second was 3yo when i got it, the last one was new. Each one lasted 5 years, 12 years and then 10 years respectively. Moved to a walkable/bikeable city & I don’t even have a driver’s license anymore. New cars are not bad as long as it doesn’t get changed out every other year, and you get one that is a reliable model.
You had a brand new car that only lasted 10 years?? What are you doing to your cars??
My friend has a 1993 Toyota Land Cruiser that the mechanic said drives like new.
I have a 2008 Nissan 350z that I’d expect to get another 10 years out of.
Sold it when we moved out of the country, lol. It was a 2007 FJ Cruiser we got for 18k, sold it for 10k. Only changed the starter (drowned it), and a couple other things. Best vehicle I ever owned.
Yet CEOs and billionaires are making more money than ever. Something has to give and soon…
Right, right after the article about tech workers living in “pods”. I mean, how much money are they making for other people? And then I know of this millionaire (who made his money in f’ing health insurance) with an 18,000 square foot house by Vail that his family visits twice a year for a few weeks.
The newest car I’ve ever owned (and currently own) is a 2007 model. Not gonna lie, with all the BS getting loaded into cars nowadays I think I’ll keep it that way. It’s easier just to have a couple of cheap shitboxes in the driveway that way you have something to drive when one of them inevitably needs work
I got a almost new 2021 last year and there’s no key hole for the door so when the key fob battery died in the middle of the winter I was stuck outside looking up on YouTube how to unlock my car . Turns out you have to pry off a piece of plastic that I ended up breaking to use my key to unlock the door . It also sets off an alarm when you open the car that way . Who thought that was a good idea ! To make things worse it was like -30 C and I had my 5 year old with me because we where sliding.
That’s why you read the manual, especially for a complex peace of tech, when you buy the thing. Just because you didn’t bother to look up how stuff works doesn’t make it bad. This one’s on you.
Or how about you don’t fix something that ain’t broken. This push to start shit is a cancer
I fucking love my push to start.
It’s easier, more secure, and cool to boot.
If my key fob dies I just stick it in a hole on the steering column and it starts right up. The door key is easily accessible in the fob, and the batteries aren’t difficult to replace regardless.
It’s also your responsibility to know and understand these things before you spend tens of thousands of dollars on any purchase. It’s not like it suddenly got like that when you got into that situation.
I can’t afford a used car. My dad helped me buy my current car and if it does I’m fucked.
2 years ago I was in need of a new truck (work related). Practically all the used stuff that’s worth a dam was priced not far behind if not more than new. The kicker, the new ones I was interested in weren’t available…so I was forced to buy used.
shrug and?
I know most people want “New cars” and fine, go chase that over priced luxury, but I’d rather a car that’s 1-2 years old that’s dropped more than half the price, and being passed over because new shiny thing came out.
People shouldn’t have to drive beaters, but buying a car for 10k isn’t a bad decision unless you’re extremely well off our only care about status symbols.
Like there’s a reason I was able to buy a house, and a good job helped, but also my wife and I lived with in our means, which is something I feel that isn’t talked about in the consumerism age. (You can buy something new, but for most things you don’t need a yearly iphone/car/or anything. A good 50 inch tv works well for a tenth of the price of the newest one. ) And yet I see people complain about not having a lot of money yet they’re always talking about the newest graphics cards, newest tvs, and newest tech… I wonder why.
I’d rather a car that’s 1-2 years old that’s dropped more than half the price […]
Except that doesn’t really happen anymore. Shoot, I’ve seen some cars appreciate in value after they roll off the lot in recent years. Hoping that reverses soon, but it sure isn’t like it used to be.
Take the Toyota 4runner for example - they’re incredibly reliable because they are simplistic in many ways with bullet proof components. You can even find 5 year old models that are within 5k of a new one.
Look at this guy with his $10k…
Get a better job. If you can’t afford a $10k car, you’re doing something wrong…
You understand that if someone in a low paid job gets a better paid job, the low paid job does not disappear in a puff of smoke? That the proportion of people in low paid work is a function of political decisions as to what the economy should look like?
I mean, the headline is fucking ridiculous (we don’t need anything like 10% of car sales to be new cars). But so is giving careers advice as a solution to the high prevalence of shit pay.
Why don’t I strap on my job helmet and squeeze down into a job cannon and fire off into job land, where jobs grow on jobbies?
The only thing that’s being done wrong here is you defending the system and not the individual.
I got a 2021 car last year with 6000km on it . It was almost full price .
Probably because it only had 6000 km on it. Average is closer to 15000 km/year.
Yeah it’s insane. I bought a 1 year old Hyundai and knocked tons of depreciation off an already cheaper brand.
At my work people be driving around in leased Range Rovers/AMG Mercs. Then they will take the piss out of my car.
Seriously? I now have more disposable income because i’m not wasting it renting a car and also I own my car… It should be me bragging
Don’t look at pickup prices. Mine was worth the same at 2 years as new.
A decade ago I was able to buy a shitbox Silverado 1500 crew cab for under $15k that ran till it rusted out from under me halfway back from the moon. It hauled garbage, pig feed, and two moves without a complaint. Same truck today would be $30k minimum and at that price I’d be too afraid of scratching it to have any fun.
So sell it and get new
I have a 2020 rav4 and it is only valued at $3k less than what I paid for it brand new. This isn’t a reality anymore.
Arguable the case for purchasing a brand new vehicle starts to make more sense as BEV become the majority as the batteries are a consumable that degrades with use and time. So long as the increased price is offset by the longer utilization of that battery.
People living in Central/Eastern Europe: 80%? Amateurs.
I don’t know ANYONE who has a new car produced in last couple of years here in Poland. According to some statistic average age of car is 15.5 years here, in fact I drive 11 year old car myself. There’s just no way I am going to dump so much cash on a freaking car (and personally I’d rather buy some nice electric bicycle instead).
and personally I’d rather buy some nice electric bicycle instead
This is exactly the reason I bought a new and good bike for the price of a used car. And what’s more is that the exercise that comes with it is free and the insurance is exponentially lower.
We really need to make more bike friendly infrastructure around the world so more people have the same option as I have.
I’d love to live and work somewhere where I could bike. The distance to my current job would be doable for me but there is zero bike infrastructure to make it feasible.
I feel for you. Sometimes I forget I have the privilege of living in Denmark which is extremely bike-friendly, something I shouldn’t take for granted.
Opel Astra, forever and ever
Truly reliable beasts, my family used to drive a mid 90’s Astra F for like 18 years and then it basically rusted away pretty quickly. Engine and everything else was totally fine. I think the only part we had to replace was the alternator…
481K new cars were sold in Poland in 2022, so it definitely happens. Sure, that’s 3 times fewer than in France (which has twice the population, though), but it’s far from “anyone”.
And yes, I know you said you “don’t know” anyone who bought one, not that they don’t exist, but I take your meaning to be that it doesn’t happen/is very rare.
New cars?
Shit, we can’t even afford groceries
A nonreligious Amen to that.
When have most Americans ever been able to afford to buy new?
After the “cash for clunkers” thing reduced the used car market buying new made more sense because of price and warranty. You also get better financing rates on new vs used. Bought my Subaru new in 2019 and could sell it for about what I paid.
Has the US been anything but a scam since its inception?
I was told in the 90’s that in America if your car was 3 years old, your neighbor might worry you weren’t doing too well, and you could buy 6 year old luxury cars for peanuts.
Yeah, that’s why public transit and multi purpose zoning are important
Here’s another reason why taking transit doesn’t bother me. For five bucks a day I can listen to podcasts and music and read books for 30 minutes, and let someone else take care of everything, I do not love everything about the bus (really you have to make everyone disembark during rush hour so you can cram your obesity scooter on there so you can go to Tim Hortons so nobody else can sit down?), but honestly it’s pretty stress free. I realize not everyone has access to transit but I think people should make more effort to use it.
The problem I run into is time. And sometimes location. My previous job, for instance, was far enough out that there was no bus service; I had to drive. My only other option was a 2-hour transit ride and then a half-hour bike ride, partly on gravel roads.
And my friend has a job that’s 15 minutes by car, or 45 minutes away by bus. Even worse, with recent construction messing with the trains, his commute has gone to 2 hours plus.
And this is in a city with a decently robust transit system.
No definitely transit should be made more robust, I know it doesn’t work for everyone. Get light rail transit everywhere and make 15 minute commutes, I say. Make transit more convenient than driving.
Adding more light rail wherever it makes sense is definitely a good plan (and should happen), but improving bus networks gives a lot more bang for the buck than focusing only on light rail. Features like off-board fare collection (paying at the bus stop, not on the vehicle), bus signal priority (extending greens and shortening reds as buses approach traffic lights), and dedicated bus lanes all improve the overall speed of buses and therefore the overall rider experience. Expanding the prevalence of these features should be a priority everywhere, particularly on higher-ridership routes.
Those are also all excellent ideas. More tranist all around I say.
really you have to make everyone disembark during rush hour so you can cram your obesity scooter on there so you can go to Tim Hortons so nobody else can sit down?
Has it…occurred to you that some disabled people have mobility issues or pain disorders that limit mobility to begin with, and that weight gain is a byproduct of not being able to walk or move or stand for very long without trouble?
I had a boss who had dwarfism and used a wheelchair 80% of the time. 20% of the time he slowly, painfully did hobble about–but it was clear as day WHY he was higher weight than he should’ve been. My own blood pressure would spike hearing the tiny sounds of pain he made when got out of his wheelchair and moved.
I have a friend with POTS–and if you’re unfamiliar with that, basically she stands up and her blood pressure and heart rate is malfunctioning so her heart acts like she’s running a marathon, the beats per minute go insane…but blood is pooling in her feet and they’re turning purple where you can’t see it because things are out of whack and despite her heart going haywaire, there’s not enough pressure to get the blood out of her feet and elsewhere. This condition happened prior to any weight gain.
I can hear her breath start to go wobbly just doing simple things because her body doesn’t regulate her blood pressure and heart rate normally. She’s gained weight because she’s at risk of passing the fuck out if she is on her feet for very long–she has to literally plan out doing simple things like going to the grocery store because if she pushes herself she might end up downed on the sidewalk relying on the helpfulness of strangers to get back up. It’s taken her many years to accept she really shouldn’t be pushing herself into a collapse because she’s worried that people will judge her for being “lazy and fat”. Comments like yours about “obesity scooters” only act to tear down all the people who ARE trying their hardest and still having their body fail them.
I have a different friend who has thyroid problems, she inherited them from her mom (and her bro has them too), and weight is a bitch for her to manage because her thyroid is fried.
I just broke my foot in July, and watched my weight inch up because it’s really fucking hard to get up stairs when you can’t put weight on one foot. I was semi bedbound for like 2 months. I’m LUCKY in that my foot will heal, but I don’t even snack and I gained 15lbs because of that one little temporary mobility issue. I’m LUCKY in that once it heals, I will be able to move normally and lose what I gained.
You could’ve made your point about transit without taking pot-shots at disabled people, who often are stuck in a terrible situation of their body failing them medically, and society often forcing them into poverty to be able to access the care they need.
Seriously, why isn’t it possible to champion mass public transit for all without shitting on the people who use it by necessity currently?
We’re you refered to physical therapy after breaking your foot? Or are you able to see if insurance will pay because your mobility has been reduced?
I had several injuries in the military that left me unable to stand, walk, drive a car, or balance for very long. With the help of physical therapy I was eventually able to walk properly, then after some time I was able to take a ride to work a job where I was sometimes sitting but often standing. Eventually I was able to work and exercise enough that I got all my balance and mobility back.
Having public transit helped me when I still didn’t have enough fine motor control to operate a pedal and brake.
Not everyone is on the same journey, but please see if you can access physical therapy. Please advocate for not just healing but making yourself whole.
You don’t have to go to Tim Hortons at rush hour when everyone is using it to go to work and school, and inconvenience everyone on the bus making them late while you back your scooter on because you just have to go get your 12 pack of donuts right now. Just wait a little while until the buses are quieter for pity’s sake.
weight gain is a byproduct of not being able to walk or move or stand for very long without trouble
Weight gain is a byproduct of consuming more calories than your body expends. Not everyone can walk or be active, but everyone can put the fork down. It’s quite simple actually
It’s quite simple actually.
Or is it?
Do you take into account that:
- Most processed food are created around the bliss point in order to make it as addictive as possible.
- Fresh food being more expensive and/or more time consuming to prepare than processed alternatives.’
- the existence of food deserts.
- advertising pushing unhealthy and addictive eatings habits down our collective throats with little to no regulations (why not do what we did with alcohol/tobacco in a lot of countries?)
- bad habits formed during childhood such as empty calories used as rewards, etc.
Imho everyone can put the fork down as in everyone can stop smoking or doing any drugs really. It’s possible but demands an extra effort that not anyone is able to put in at any given moment (without even taking relapses into account).
To me it really has some “it’s your fault you got conned” vibes ^^’
When I was in college I lost weight when I had no access to a kitchen. I ate a lot of fast food but just counted my calories. Sometimes you have to do weird things like skipping the buns on a burger but it’s really not that hard
I’m glad it wasn’t that hard for you ^^
But I think you’re confusing hard and difficult.
The biggest problem I run I to with transit in most cities is the time sink, security flaws, and expense.
I drive to a park and ride where I have to pay 12 dollars to have my car broken into. Then wait 20 minutes to pamy another $15 to take the light rail that drops me off 8 blocks from my destination, then wait 20 minutes to pay 5 bucks for the bus that drops me 2 blocks away, then walk to my destination.
Or I could drive straight to my destination, pay 8 bucks for the parking garage with a security gate, and save an hour.
Right, the “take mass transit” works great … in places with functional mass transit.
Honestly good. There are plenty of used and pre-owned vehicles that just need minor repairs or tune-ups. I drive a used 2015 Chevy Spark, financed it back in 2022 and it’s nearly paid off. My car only needed a new battery, new tires, and an oil change. My mom on the other hand financed a new luxury Acura RDX back in 2018 as an upgrade from her 2006 Honda CRV, she’s still making payments to this day. I asked why she didn’t get a newer Honda CRV and she said that she didn’t want the same vehicle as a McDonald’s worker.
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In my 40’s here and never bought a new car. Every one gets a little less old though!
Same, but I’ve never bought an old car either, or gotten a drivers license. But I’m in the Netherlands and the times I truely need a car are negligible.
I guess that’s why used car prices are through the roof too. My neighbor bought a nice but 6 year old car 2½ years ago, he can sell it now at he same price he gave! We bought an older car 4 years ago, and there is no way we can get a similar deal today, prices in this segment have almost doubled! And the prices were already inflated 4 years ago.
It’s ridiculous how expensive used cars have become.
